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Subject Topic: Insure or not
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Message posted by Tentz on 09/4/2012 at 12:49pm
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Quote: Originally posted by The 2 Tops on 09/4/2012
On the subject of not having at least T.P. cover on a van, is it morally right, in the event of an uninsured van causing damage to another on site (e.g., fire), for the owner of such damaged van to have to claim on his/her insurance and lose their NCB through no fault of their own?

Or are we to consider this indifference as being 'proper' under the general heading of "blow you Jack" as seems the norm throughout modern society? When we started camping, fellow beings were more thoughtful towards others.

Bertie.



What you are failing to take on board here is that there are no 'moral issues' when it comes to insurance claims. If your caravan was burnt out as a result as a fire in an adjacent caravan there would be no claim on the owner of that adjacent 'van unless liability could be proved. You would obviously claim for your 'van from your insurance. If the owner of the other 'van had insurance he would claim of his.

If for some bizarre reason, rather than claim off your own insurance you attempted to directly sue the owner of the other caravan then you would have to prove he was liable for the fire. If he was insured, his insurance company would contest it & if you were unable to prove the owner was liable you would lose. Even if the owner was in the caravan at the time it would be impossible to prove it was his fault/negligence that the fire started.

You appear to be confusing caravan insurance with car insurance & looking at it in the same way as you would an accident between 2 cars. Car insurance is a legal requirement, caravan insurance is not because when the caravan is a road vehicle, being towed it is covered for third party risks under the car insurance.

On site, a caravan is not a road vehicle & I'm failing to see how a fire involving 2 adjacent caravans would be settled 'knock for knock' by insurance co's in the same way as a crash between 2 cars on the road.


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Message posted by The 2 Tops on 09/4/2012 at 1:56pm
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I am not confusing anything, Tentz.  If you own a property, even if it's a caravan, and it caused damage to an adjacent one on a campsite, you would without question be liable at law.  The fire brigades are very proficient at determining causes of fire, so proof of how it started would be of no difficulty to them.  I cannot imagine how you arrive at the idea that you can claim indemnity in the event of your property causing damage/injury to a third party. 

Regarding caravans under tow, yes they are covered for T.P.risks, but they are also subject to the Construction and Use Act for road vehicles; lights, tyres, mechanical maintenance for road worthiness, etc.  You can get fines and/or points on your licence relating to the caravan, even if your towcar is in perfect condition.

Concerning the detached situation, I will obtain a professional, definitive answer after the hols. and report back, since this is a point of law that should be of interest to all of us.

Regards, Bertie. 



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Message posted by Tentz on 09/4/2012 at 2:21pm
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Quote: Originally posted by The 2 Tops on 09/4/2012
If you own a property, even if it's a caravan, and it causeddamage to an adjacent one on a campsite,you would without question be liable at law.

This simply is not true, negligence(as opposed to an accident)has to be proved, ownership does not make you automatically liable. When caravans burn there is usually very little left & certainly not enough to prove whether the fire was caused by accident or negligence.


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Message posted by matty2303 on 09/4/2012 at 2:39pm
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has anyone considered that if you read the small print most campsites require you to have third party liabilty insurance to be on the site

Message posted by OliverDay on 09/4/2012 at 2:39pm
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Bertie

You might like to read this news item from the BBC.

As Tentz states you would have to prove negligence.


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Message posted by The 2 Tops on 09/4/2012 at 2:43pm
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Tentz, let's agree to differ for now.  We both think we are right, but there is a way to settle it; by asking in the right places.   So I am throwing down the gauntlet - let's get the true facts and see who is right.  Agreed?

Bertie. 



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Message posted by swiftsure on 09/4/2012 at 2:55pm
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 2 words only on this subject !!!

 public liability !!!!!



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Message posted by Tentz on 09/4/2012 at 2:57pm
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Quote: Originally posted by matty2303 on 09/4/2012
has anyone considered that if you read the small print most campsites require you to have third party liabilty insurance to be on the site

Do you have a link for that, How could tent campers have it & does caravan insurance actually include public liabilty insurance?



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Message posted by matty2303 on 09/4/2012 at 4:04pm
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my caravan insurance does yes (caravanguard)for 1 million off the top of my head , as for campers they too can buy insurance , i have seen numerous booking forms and terms requesting that you have public liability insurance for your unit

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