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Subject Topic: Tesla 3 towing?
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Message posted by bessie50024/9/2018 at 10:03am
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By the time we are all in a position to drive electric cars, things would of moved on enough for us all to charge at something similar to what we use now.

were talking a long time away yet

Bessie   

Message posted by blueexpo9724/9/2018 at 11:06am
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-------------
XVI yes?

As well is two words!
How does a sage know everything about everything? or does he? or does he just think he does?
Remember, if you buy something you bought it, not brought it.

Message posted by Extremebiker024/9/2018 at 11:25am
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The irony being that that's how you used to have to start a petrol engine!

Message posted by 664DaveS27/9/2018 at 11:21pm
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Just watched fifth gear,they tested a Hyundai hydrogen fuel cell suv in London.It came out very well.
No lugging around heavy batteries,no pollution uses electric motors.
Only 8 filling places in UK but that could change!
Cost was £60k but thats for a well equipped luxury suv.
Smaller ones could be made and prices will come
down.
Apparantly popular in California as Honda make hydrogen powered cars too.Charging points probably more common!
Hyundai apparantly making hydrogen powered trucks for Switzerland.
Gets my vote. It takes energy to make hydrogen but no waiting for ages to charge heavy expensive batteries,yes hydrogen is inflammable, but we have lpg powered vehicles now.
Not sure what mining materials used in batteries is doing to the environment either?
Nickel,cadmium lithium etc!

-------------
DS-There's more to life than football!!!

Message posted by ST110028/9/2018 at 10:09am
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Interesting bit on the news about Eton Musk is facing fraud charges .. duping investors.

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Message posted by Mike300328/9/2018 at 11:34am
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Quote: Originally posted by 664DaveS on 27/9/2018
Just watched fifth gear,they tested a Hyundai hydrogen fuel cell suv in London.It came out very well.
No lugging around heavy batteries,no pollution uses electric motors.
Only 8 filling places in UK but that could change!
Cost was £60k but thats for a well equipped luxury suv.
Smaller ones could be made and prices will come
down.
Apparantly popular in California as Honda make hydrogen powered cars too.Charging points probably more common!
Hyundai apparantly making hydrogen powered trucks for Switzerland.
Gets my vote. It takes energy to make hydrogen but no waiting for ages to charge heavy expensive batteries,yes hydrogen is inflammable, but we have lpg powered vehicles now.
Not sure what mining materials used in batteries is doing to the environment either?
Nickel,cadmium lithium etc!



Like the sound of that Dave, that seems a far better idea going forward, and could spell the end for BEVs before they really got going. Far better for the planet too

A big 👍👍


Message posted by Mike300328/9/2018 at 11:36am
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Quote: Originally posted by ST1100 on 28/9/2018
Interesting bit on the news about Eton Musk is facing fraud charges .. duping investors.



Oh dear, oh dear. Is ordering a new Tesla 3 such a great idea I wonder.

I am going to cancel mine soonest. 😀

Message posted by 664DaveS28/9/2018 at 11:55am
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If I were to buy an EV it would be from a manufacturer such as Toyota,Nissan or Hyundai, who are big and have a proven record.
If I was still working a BEV such as Nissan would suit our useage, but would probably be more likely to get a hybrid for the better range.
If lottery fairy visits,it would still be a RangeRover and a Porsche or maybe a Bentley Convertible! (Wife likes them!)
We live in hope!
Fuel cells seem more practical,only waste product is water.
It makes sense to look towards the new technology as oil won't last forever.
If everyone has to drive EVs, govt revenue from fuel will disappear so road tax or electricity prices will have to make up the difference! Have the greens considered that?

Post last edited on 28/09/2018 11:59:57

-------------
DS-There's more to life than football!!!

Message posted by Extremebiker028/9/2018 at 2:04pm
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As someone owning a BEV and a PHEV I don't see fuel cells taking off. Can't be bothered making a special trip to a fuel station (petrol/diesel/hydrogen) now I know the convenience of just charging at home. Imagine having to take your mobile phone to a special fueling station, that's how stupid it is. But we're all used to it (or were at some point).

Message posted by Francais28/9/2018 at 2:09pm
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Tesla have got the edge on battery tech, offering 8 years unlimited mileage on the battery pack, whilst Nissan etc offer the same 8 years warranty, but mileage capped at 100k, that says a lot about Tesla batteries.

In my current job, I would hit 100k miles in less than 3 years, which make's the Tesla Model 3 very apealing to fleet buyers.

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Message posted by saxo128/9/2018 at 2:44pm
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It will be a long time before Hydrogen fuel cells are adopted,it is a chicken and egg situation,the cost of a Hydrogen filling station is in the millions of pounds and there aren't enough cars around to justify the cost of installing them..On the other side of the coin purchasers of new vehicles are reluctant to buy a vehicle when there are so few filling stations.
It's the supply and demand dilemma.
saxo1

Message posted by LlaniDavis28/9/2018 at 2:53pm
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I don't know where you are getting your figures from, but they have just installed a hydrogen station in Abergaveny, and that didn't cost millions. And there are several in London.
Is this more of your anti-fossil fuel tirade?

And this car is on the road and the second one currently under construction
https://www.riversimple.com/the-design-of-the-rasa/
All developed and built in Mid Wales!

Message posted by saxo128/9/2018 at 3:17pm
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Quote: Originally posted by LlaniDavis on 28/9/2018
I don't know where you are getting your figures from, but they have just installed a hydrogen station in Abergaveny, and that didn't cost millions. And there are several in London.
Is this more of your anti-fossil fuel tirade?

And this car is on the road and the second one currently under construction
https://www.riversimple.com/the-design-of-the-rasa/
All developed and built in Mid Wales!


Oh Dear!
From the H2 industry promoting the use of Hydrogen:
Quote:
"Stations that use hydrogen delivered as a gas have an average storage of 180 kg/day and an estimated the total cost of $2 million, which includes equipment, design, construction, and commissioning.

Liquid Delivery


Liquid hydrogen truck delivery to station dispenser

Stations that use hydrogen delivered as a liquid have an average storage of 350 kg/day and estimated total constructed and commissioned cost of $2.8 million.


Onsite Production


On-site electrolysis production at a hydrogen station

Stations that make hydrogen onsite from electrolysis of water have an average storage of 120 kg/day and estimated total constructed and commissioned cost of $3.2 million"
Before you remount your high horse and proclaim that is from an American website below is the UK industry take on it!
"A Toyota Mirai owner in London now has a small selection of hydrogen filling stations to choose from, but that number can currently be counted on one hand. Given the immense cost of building hydrogen filling stations, and the minuscule number of fuel cell vehicles currently on the road, this technology is barely in its second trimester. There's a degree of chicken-or-egg to it, too, as buyers are unmotivated to buy into such fledgling infrastructure.

“We really do need a sufficient number of stations available to the public before it’s reasonable to expect the public to buy significant numbers of vehicles,” says Tipper. “We’re of the view that the stations come first.”

I suppose they must be wrong!
saxo1




Post last edited on 28/09/2018 15:33:50

Message posted by saxo128/9/2018 at 3:46pm
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Quote: Originally posted by LlaniDavis on 28/9/2018
I don't know where you are getting your figures from, but they have just installed a hydrogen station in Abergaveny, and that didn't cost millions. And there are several in London.
Is this more of your anti-fossil fuel tirade?

And this car is on the road and the second one currently under construction
https://www.riversimple.com/the-design-of-the-rasa/
All developed and built in Mid Wales!

It's cheap because they aren't paying for the installation the French co is providing it.
And as for the car £40,000000 to build 20 cars!
And will it pull a caravan?
saxo1




Message posted by saxo128/9/2018 at 4:11pm
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A few more facts about hydrogen cell cars:

The government is easing the pain. Earlier this year one company, ITM Power, was awarded £3.59m in grants, including £1.89m from the government, to build and run two new stations in London. 
ITM, which opened Britain’s newest hydrogen pump last month, in Rotherham, uses wind power to make hydrogen from water. The company says that it can make 80kg of hydrogen a day, enough to power 16 cars.
Emma Guthrie, from Air Products, says that using electricity to convert water into hydrogen is inefficient. She says plug-in hybrids make more sense, with batteries that can be recharged at home and a fuel cell for longer journeys with a hydrogen tank that can be refuelled in minutes.
saxo1

Message posted by amara 52028/9/2018 at 4:13pm
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Quote: Originally posted by Extremebiker0 on 28/9/2018
As someone owning a BEV and a PHEV I don't see fuel cells taking off. Can't be bothered making a special trip to a fuel station (petrol/diesel/hydrogen) now I know the convenience of just charging at home. Imagine having to take your mobile phone to a special fueling station, that's how stupid it is. But we're all used to it (or were at some point).

Not everyone can charge at home, eg flat dwellers or those without a drive and car parked on the road so they would still need to go to a charging station and plug in then wait until battery is charged. People living in major cities will have problems




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