Last March we had discussions with a local builder (one man business, we have used him before) about some changes to our bathroom. He said he was busy all last year, so we verbally agreed to have the work done in Spring 2023.
He has now (presumably because of work pressures) employed an account manager, who has emailed us and asked for all the payment up front. When we queried this, we were offered an arrangement to pay half now and half when the materials are to be ordered.
We are anxious about this, partly since we have never fully agreed what work is needed, discussed materials (tiles, flooring etc)and so on. After some discussion between us, we have offered a 10% deposit now, in order to secure a "slot"; the cost of materials once agreed, and a final payment when the work is completed. We may be wrong, but we felt this was a reasonable way of conducting business.
We have nothing in writing, other than these emails.
The account manager has now emailed us to say policy is policy and if we don't want to have the work done, to let her know and she will allocate the slot to someone else.
We live in a village, as does the builder, who is well known and liked. Indeed, we like him too, so we don't want to cause problems. Can anyone advise?
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As no money has changed hands as yet,then you have either to accept their policy or walk away.
However you could agree to their policy providing it satisfied your policy of having a detailed and agreed schedule of work, materials to be used and date of completion, with suitable penalty provisions for failure to achieve.
Find another builder. You have no contract if the builder hasn’t given you a written estimate for materials & labour (flat amount or hourly rate), VAT etc, or an “all in” price that you’ve accepted in writing. If you do decide to pay something based on a verbal agreement with a builder who you trust, eg pay for materials that you have proof that he has already procured for you, remember the cost of materials will go up: pay in advance now & it won’t cover the cost next year when the builder actually buys the tiles etc. And make sure it’s not made out to the accounts manager & put your understanding of the agreement in writing, sent recorded delivery. The firm may have a website with Ts&Cs about this “policy” too.
You will lose your money if the builder’s business folds - I’d worry that the accounts manager is trying to pull in money to shore up a failing business with cash flow problems.
Conversely, have a friendly chat to the builder himself, rather than going through his intermediary. Has he instructed the accounts manager to demand money up front? If he’s busy, he won’t be overseeing what they’re doing & might not know that’s happening.
If you live in the same village why not have a word with the builder, I for one would not agree to hand any monies over, spring is a long time away, I am having my ridge tiles replaced in the spring and was not asked for payment when booking and if they had I would have declined, I worked for myself as a decorator for 30+ years and never once asked for monies up front, on big jobs I asked for stage payments after work had commenced and usually after a couple of months, companies can and do go bust and then you would be one of the last in a queue for monies refunded
Quote: Originally posted by JoannaLesley on 24/9/2022
Thank you all for your helpful advice. We have now decided not to go ahead with the work.
I think that is a wise decision. I would certainly never pay in full up-front for work like that to be done. I would want to ensure that it was completed to my satisfaction before I made the final payment. Even being asked for payment in full up-front would make me highly suspicious of the company's financial position.
I also did 30+ years as a self employed Landscaper, and never asked for monies up front. I cannot understand many trades today, as they do not seem to hold trading accounts with builders merchants. This allows you to 'book' materials, and usually pay for them after you've completed the job and collected. This 'paying for materials' to do the job is not something i did unless they were 'specialist' - something that had to be ordered in from an unfamiliar source. This was rarely more than a handfull of times a year. Otherwise, i did the job - by booking the materials, got paid, and settled up at the month end. Some trades just try it on nowadays, leading me to 'fall out' with more than a couple round here since i relocated and got various quotes for jobs now ive 'lost' all my contacts built up over 40 years. They arent happy when its clear they cant blind you with science, and you know what they are really trying to pull.
Further to this - we received an email from the builder later to say that his account has been hacked and that he would never ask for a deposit. When I looked back at the emails, I realised that part way through a thread his name had changed (we have him as Jim in our email addresses and emails started coming from James - we hadn't noticed).
Much relief all round. We will speak to him just to clarify that all is still Ok and that his diary didn't get wiped in the process.
Thank you everyone for you advice and support.
------------- Freedom is a light caravan and an open road.
Quote: Originally posted by JoannaLesley on 25/9/2022
Further to this - we received an email from the builder later to say that his account has been hacked and that he would never ask for a deposit. When I looked back at the emails, I realised that part way through a thread his name had changed (we have him as Jim in our email addresses and emails started coming from James - we hadn't noticed).
Much relief all round. We will speak to him just to clarify that all is still Ok and that his diary didn't get wiped in the process.
Thank you everyone for you advice and support.
That is very good news, but by the same token if you had approached him earlier he would have wised up sooner. I wonder if anyone else fell for the scam?
Quote: Originally posted by JoannaLesley on 25/9/2022
Further to this - we received an email from the builder later to say that his account has been hacked and that he would never ask for a deposit. When I looked back at the emails, I realised that part way through a thread his name had changed (we have him as Jim in our email addresses and emails started coming from James - we hadn't noticed).
Much relief all round. We will speak to him just to clarify that all is still Ok and that his diary didn't get wiped in the process.
Thank you everyone for you advice and support.
That is very good news, but by the same token if you had approached him earlier he would have wised up sooner. I wonder if anyone else fell for the scam?
We did try, but he was away. When we saw him he told us that his emails had been down for a couple of days. As he was away in his motorhome he just assumed it was a glitch. All sorted now.
------------- Freedom is a light caravan and an open road.
Hmmmm the cynic in me suggests that this is the same person running two types of business under two faces - if you want to maintain a casual relationship based on trust youd call yourself Jim (or Pete or Dave) and if you want to sound more formal and get money youd call yourself James (or Peter or David etc). I'd look for more thorough evidence that the hacking is actually the case and not just take it on trust.
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Topic: Getting work done in the house
via mobile 24/9/2022 at 4:06pm
