I am in the process of buying a caravan that weighs 1465kg fully loaded with equipment.
The kerb weight of my car is 1350kg but when we actually travel with the caravan the total weight of the car with passengers and luggage will be 1600kg.
I've seen the various web sites that state the caravan cannot be heavier than the kerb weight but once the car is fully loaded, we would have 135kg to spare - is this ok?
My car has an approved maximum towing weight of 1700kg.
I note that the same rules don't seem to apply to towing horse trailers where you seem to be able to go the maximum weight that the car can tow - i.e. in my case 1700kg.
Sorry but you need a heavier tow car than 1350kg if your towing a van with a MPTLM of 1465kg .
Both clubs would not endorse your outfit as being a good safe towing match and depending when you passed your driving test you may not be able to tow such a combination
Having a caravan heavier than the car is a big NO.
Manipulating the figures wont help.
Same rules for towing a horse trailer and a caravan. In the years gone by though they had little information on what the maximum weight your car can tow is.
Now that information is available and a lot of cases its on the V5.
My cars gross towing weight is 1800kg, But i cant tow 1800kg unless the cars empty.
Add one 75kg passenger and it reduces the towing limit by 75kg.
So you need to know the cars max towing weight AND the gross train weight.
They recommend the caravan is 85% of the cars UNLADEN weight. Not laden.
So in your case loading the car to make it heavy enough for the van could put it over the gross train weight.
Either way it sounds like you need a smaller caravan or a bigger car.
If the MPTLM of the van was 1350kg - i.e. equal to the car kerb weight, then whilst this would be right on the limit of 100% this would be ok to drive according to the various web sites.
However, if the load in the car in this scenario was only 100kg, the total weight differential between the car and the van would be 35kg less than the actual weight differential I would have with this caravan (i.e. 135kg)as described in my first post and which is unsafe.
Surely it would be safer with a 135kg weight difference compared to a 100kg weight difference?
The Audi figure is a bit irrelevant really. You certainly cannot exceed that figure but it doesn't mean you would have a safe tow. It just means the car passed certain tests with hill starts etc.
I share the concerns of the others. The car and caravan is a poor match and would be difficult to handle, especially for an inexperienced tower. You need a bigger car or smaller caravan.
Manufacturers figures are whats the maximum weight you can attach to the car and pull away without the engine, gearbox or axles blowing up or it ripping the floorpan out.
When the caravans heavier than the car you risk the "tail wagging the dog".
Im an emergency the heavier caravan decides on which direction of travel you go not the steering wheel.
Your not even close to being sensible. 100% then maybe if your experienced but your van probably exceeds the cars weight before you start adding your personal items.
Dont get confused between the legal limit and the recomended limit and the manufacturer limit 3 differnt things
Legally you cant pull more than the kerbweight (althugh i have never seen the legislation)
Also the whole outfit cant exceed the gross train weight listed on the plate on the car (this will also show max axle weights too). This is what plod/vosa will look at on a roadside stop. And is quite clear in the road vehicles regs 1986.
The recomended limit is just that. Towing at or close to 100% is legal, but harder on the vehicle and the higher the figure the higher the demand on driver thats why the85% rule is suggested.
The 3rd is the manufacturer limit that the car could tow without ripping the back end off the car and up a predifined slope to allow comparison at point of sale.
Quote: Originally posted by Tall Bloke on 18/10/2012
Grampian 91
Thanks for post.
I passed my test in 1992.
Car is Audi A3 2.0 TDI Sportback.
Car kerb weight is 1350kg.
Maximum tow weight is 1700kg as per Audi.
Try an emergency stop with a caravan that's heavier than your Audi and you may well end up in a jacknife situation
Sorry but your A3 is no where near heavy enough to tow a van with an MPTLM of 1465kg .
Quote: Originally posted by jasie on 18/10/2012
Dont get confused between the legal limit and the recomended limit and the manufacturer limit 3 differnt things
Legally you cant pull more than the kerbweight (althugh i have never seen the legislation)
Also the whole outfit cant exceed the gross train weight listed on the plate on the car (this will also show max axle weights too). This is what plod/vosa will look at on a roadside stop. And is quite clear in the road vehicles regs 1986.
The recomended limit is just that. Towing at or close to 100% is legal, but harder on the vehicle and the higher the figure the higher the demand on driver thats why the85% rule is suggested.
The 3rd is the manufacturer limit that the car could tow without ripping the back end off the car and up a predifined slope to allow comparison at point of sale.
The OP may legally tow a trailer that weighs more than the cars kerbweight, he has said his licence is dated 1992 which gives him the required licence, though IMO and the opinion of all the professional associations he would be foolish to do so.
The 85% guideline suggests that someone new to towing should not tow a caravan that weighs more than 85% of the cars kerbweight, but with experience it is acceptable to tow up to 100%. So as a person who has never towed before the OP would be very well advised to either swap his car or buy a lighter caravan, to do anything else I would suggest would mean that he needs to be wearing a pair of brown trousers.
------------- Bill
For a licence dated 1997 or later you must add together the plated max weight of the caravan and trailer, if the total is 3500 or less you can tow it. You may even tow a caravan with a MAM greater than the cars unladen mass the restriction was removed in 2013
I've decide to change my car instead of the van and I am going for a 2L Picasso that has a kerb weight of just under 1700 so the van is pretty much spot on the 85% figure.
Quote: Originally posted by Tall Bloke on 19/10/2012
Once again, thanks for the advice yesterday.
I've decide to change my car instead of the van and I am going for a 2L Picasso that has a kerb weight of just under 1700 so the van is pretty much spot on the 85% figure.
Be sure of the Picasso's towing capacity , while it may have a greater kerbweight than your A3 some models have a low towing capacity of 1300kg which cant be exceeded
Both current 2litre diesel manual & auto C4 Picasso have 1600kg tow weight with kerb weight of 1720kg for manual according to brochure so ok for that caravan.
Citroen can be applauded for mainly quoting 'real world' tow weights for their cars, not the theoretical max tow weights based only on car's actual ability to tow from a hill start which causes so much confusion with caravanners.
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Topic: Towing for the first time - HELP!
