Quote: Originally posted by Wilkos on 20/8/2007
So called 'eco-warriors' put themselves out to protect our countryside. Their efforts help prevent overdevelopment and noise pollution.
That is of course your opinion and you are fully entitled to it.
Personally I just hope someone somewhere is working on a foolproof bung for a cow's rear end, so we can cut our national carbon whatsisname by a huge margin.
Don't forget that towering scientific intellect George W Bush who says theres no such thing as global warming. So keep on driving the 4X4s and go on lots of cheap flights, it won't change a thing and that's official!
They've already got my pub roll-ups. Now they're after my car, my occasional(annual) jet travel. We'll soon be back to where we were 200 years ago...being born, living and dying within a 5 mile radius of our(unheated) hovels. Why can't we be left alone ?
Quote: Originally posted by rexgrant on 20/8/2007
Take glass This is made from sand, it requires more heat to make it from scratch than to remelt reclaimed glass. Full stop. The glass that is made from scratch can be colored to any colour and made into any type of product that the producer requires, Reclaimed glass has to be sorted into type and colour be cleaned and free from contaminates so this puts the cost of reclaimed glass way above normal costs so most is not used to remake glass, I do not know what percentage is reclaimed but it is only a small percentage. The rest is ground up and used in fancy concrete and to top graves and such. But I am sure what I have just said is nothing to do with camping and I should not wasted the site bandwidth to discuss it.
But now that you have mentined it Reg I feel obliged to post a reply to your comments regarding glass recycling. Glass recycling is very worthwhile, not just because it reduces landfill costs for local authorities.
In 2006; 752 thousand Tonnes of cullet (processed recycled glass) was re-used by the UK glass container industry. That works out to be 1/3 reclaimed back into glassmaking.
The problem of usage is more to do with the difference between what we make and what us as consumers purchase. As a nation we buy more green glass items than UK makers need so there is a surplus.
Reg is right that some is used in concretes but there are other uses such as glass wool insulation (200,000 Tonnes). Lots of research is being done so that more of the coloured glass can be recycled into products such as bricks.
Why is it that some posters find it so difficult to listen to the arguments instead of just attacking the messenger while glibly insisting that "it's a free country!" or that they should not be"told what to do" or just pointing the finger at others who they say are even worse?
I cannot believe that as fellow campers you can remain as unconcerned about climate change and carbon footprints as some of you do!
We should be in the front line of this debate not just making fun of those who want to engage in an informed argument not making dishonest arguments in order to avoid questioning ourselves!!
------------- Life is what you make it...Just get on with it!
Some climatologistst have been saying for ages that we are in a natural 10,000 year cycle of climate change. Oceanographers now think they may have been wrong about the cooling of the gulf stream.
Some people are really bothered about climate change, some aren't. Some people were in favor of shutting down pits in the UK in order to cut down on the use of carbon fuels in the 80's. I lost my job and now we import coal from as far away as china and buy electricity from the French. Go figure.
If all you have to worry about is the changing climate, then lucky you I say!
I'm really bothered about the sandwich trolley not turning up this morning. But I haven't seen any wholemeal warriors camping outside in my support yet.
Because when I'm told I should be engaging in debate, it usually ends up costing me more money ?
I would like a debate about the ethics and usefulness of taxing the general populus as a way of righting wrongs of successive governments and industry. About the logic of how taxing people some more is supposed to stop them doing something (e.g. heating their home) when there's no alternative. While we're about it, we could have a fringe debate about individuals living in cities with great public transport telling those of us that have no other means of travelling long distances how much damage our car is doing.
Example 1, late 1980s - "use diesel cars, they're much better for the environment than petrol." Everyone buys diesel cars. Leap forward 20 years. "Did we really say better ? How silly of us, we actually meant worse. Give us your money".
Example 2, late 1980s - "use oil heating, coal is so bad for the environment and it's going to run out anyway". Everyone installs oil. Leap forward 20 years. "Did we really say oil ? How silly of us, we actually meant solar and wind. Oil sucks. Ya, boo, oil. Look at your instiable appetite for oil (*). Give us your money."
(*) This one in particular annoys me. I can ensure anyone who wants to listen that my heating isn't on for a minute more than needed. My appetite for oil is as low as a low thing. AND we've got all the insulation and stuff. Still costs me a fortune for a bit of heat though.
Talking about informed arguments - the crusty type of eco-warrior are not the guardians of the environment, and IMO get more press than they warrant because they always give a good photo opportunity to the papers.
They certainly didn't create the national parks, listed buildings, sites of special scientific interest, areas of outstanding natural beauty or conservation areas. They didn't set up the Natinal Trust either - that was a bunch of Christain Socialists.
Your local planning department has done more to protect the environment.
Quote: Originally posted by stevie9398 on 20/8/2007
Quote: Originally posted by rexgrant on 20/8/2007Take glass This is made from sand, it requires more heat to make it from scratch than to remelt reclaimed glass.Full stop. The glass that is made from scratch can be colored to any colour and made into any type of product that the producer requires, Reclaimed glass has to be sorted into type and colour be cleaned and free from contaminates so this puts the cost of reclaimed glass way above normal costs so most is not used to remake glass, I do not know what percentage is reclaimed but it is only a small percentage. The rest is ground up and used in fancy concrete and to top graves and such.
But I am sure what I have just said is nothing to do with camping and I should not wasted the site bandwidth to discuss it.
But now that you have mentined it Reg I feel obliged to post a reply to your comments regarding glass recycling. Glass recycling is very worthwhile, not just because it reduces landfill costs for local authorities.
<FONT color=#0000ff>In 2006; 752 thousand Tonnes of cullet (processed recycled glass) was re-used by the UK glass container industry. That works out to be 1/3 reclaimed back into glassmaking.
<FONT color=#0000ff>The problem of usage is more to do with the difference between what we make and what us as consumers purchase. As a nation we buy more green glass items than UK makers need so there is a surplus.
<FONT color=#0000ff>Reg is right that some is used in concretes but there are other uses such as glass wool insulation (200,000 Tonnes). Lots of research is being done so that more of the coloured glass can be recycled into products such as bricks.
Hi steveie
Thank you for the information, it is always good to add to ones knowledge. But as you say the only benefit of recycling glass is to stop us putting it back were it came from, into landfill No real benefit to the carbon footprint of industry, But it dose help the government to play the EEC game. and add to the tonnage recycled.
Let face it. most things come from the earth and most things could be made biodegradable and what is not we have the technology to burn this waste through multi after burner systems, But it is the cost, and if we take more land to put back what came out of the ground we have a handful of ex university Wally's who could not get a worthwhile degree shouting about it to keep themselves in work.
No Stevie recycling to so call save on our industrial carbon footprint is a game the that governments have invented to save money and to keep the green revolution from going over the top as these people are likely to do.
Just my opinion.
Rex
PS But after all should we be discussing this on Camping under Canvas.
Post last edited on 20/08/2007 16:23:30
------------- "Be the person your dog thinks you are" (BM)
Quote: Originally posted by Carl at atompl.co.uk on 20/8/2007
Some climatologistst have been saying for ages that we are in a natural 10,000 year cycle of climate change. Oceanographers now think they may have been wrong about the cooling of the gulf stream.
Some people are really bothered about climate change, some aren't. Some people were in favor of shutting down pits in the UK in order to cut down on the use of carbon fuels in the 80's. I lost my job and now we import coal from as far away as china and buy electricity from the French. Go figure.
If all you have to worry about is the changing climate, then lucky you I say!
I'm really bothered about the sandwich trolley not turning up this morning. But I haven't seen any wholemeal warriors camping outside in my support yet.
I think they were right - the sea was freezing last week.
The Politicians themselves admit "we just don't know" when asked if global warming is happening!
Al Gore is cavorting around the world, running a mansion with 20 times the average consumption of electric of the average American and our own Government make numerous trips that could be done by video conferencing. Where's the example being set to us mere beings by these people who are committed to climate change?
Do as I say, not as I do if you ask me. As for the pop stars who attended the green concert the other day....... hypocrites the lot of them.
What happened to global cooling Mr Gore cos in the seventies you told us it was inevitable! Is it any wonder we have no faith in what we are having rammed down our throats day in day out?
This thread is in the wrong forum, it should be in Outdoor Life and General Chat and is a perfectly natural thread for that forum. Anyone who feels differently does not have to contribute to it.
Point two:
Whilst I'm fairly sure that mankind can contribute to climate change in a few minor ways, I don't believe he can influence a natural cycle that has operated for millions of years to any great extent.
Point three:
Whilst the earth's climate may be a juggernaut that cannot be deflected, the resources of the earth are finite, and we should do what we can to conserve them by minimising their consumption and recycling as much as possible. Landfill is a blight on our countryside and should be minimised if not eliminated.
Point four:
As long as there is more than one person contributing to these forums there will be differences of opinion. It is a measure of the maturity of the contributor as to whether or not s/he can argue their case without resorting to the sort of posts that will get the thread locked. It helps if contributors retain a sense of humour!
Point five:
Whilst I may not agree with the opinions of others, I defend to the death their right to air their opinions, so let's continue to debate and avoid haranguing each other. It is only by reasoned debate that another's opinions can be changed.
Point six:
All the above points are my personal opinions and as such are open to reasonable debate, none of us can be sure that our opinions are 100% correct.
What happened to the predicted Ice age of the 80's, by now we should be all using 4x4's and fishing through holes, funny how it seems to be going the opposite way and we are supposedly getting warmer, highest temps so far this year are worse than they have been in a long time so perhaps the ice age is actually on its way and the eco friendly of the 80's had it right after all!
Just my wee observation from past history of the news reports, or is that hystorical news!
What happened to the predicted Ice age of the 80's, by now we should be all using 4x4's and fishing through holes, funny how it seems to be going the opposite way and we are supposedly getting warmer, highest temps so far this year are worse than they have been in a long time so perhaps the ice age is actually on its way and the eco friendly of the 80's had it right after all!
Just my wee observation from past history of the news reports, or is that hystorical news!
I thought you were? - apart from those of you with the people carriers that is ..... ( YaY! throw another twenty quid on the road tax Gordon)
Amazing family weekend with old steam engines, classic car displays, market stalls, and full catering and bar. And camping on site - Save £25 by booking in advance.
Topic: carbon foot print and camping
