We are off to France tomorrow for a couple of weeks for our first trip with our Trigano 415 and I've been researching what we need to have in terms of paperwork etc.
However one thing I cannot seem to find a definite answer on is whether different speed limits apply when towing a trailer? Can anyone help please? The trailer has a max gross weight of 650KG (braked) and my car is an Octavia vRS so I'm nowhere near the upper weight restrictions.
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As long as your gross train mas (GTM) is less than 3.5t, then the speed limit is 110kph (~70mph). Your GTM is calculated by adding the vehicle weight and the rated towing capacity (can be found in your car manual). If this is less than 3.5t, then 110kph is your limit.
Don't forget that the limit drops in bad weather too.
I'm pretty sure this is correct, but please correct me if I'm wrong.
If the gross weight of the outfit is over 3500kg you are restricted otherwise not. There were discussions on this on here a while ago.
We think our oufit is just about borderline so we are going to stick to about 60 mph max on autoroutes!! Voila a linky -you don't have to be a member to access it!
I was under the impression that it was the plated maximum possible train weight and not the actual one. Eg my Sedona has a plated maximum train weight of 4250kg, so my speeds are lower. However, the actual weight of this, car plus trailer is around 3000kg. Your Octavia is 1950kg and max trailer is 1400kg giving a max train weight of 3350 kg, below the 3500 limit, so you should be OK. (repeat should). Have a good trip.
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On another note has anyone seen any towed vehicles in France, other than French HGVs with the 90/80 stickers? This could include UK outfits as well as continental ones. Eg a Dutch VW van with a camping trailer. According to the CC article above, it could apply to UK HGV's too. Any pictures or evidence from anyone? We are off next week for a while, without trailer so will have a look too.
That's where the confusion is coming from alright. I know that our rig is well below the 3.5t limit so that would imply that restrictions don't apply but I can't find any definite proof.
I normally travel towing at around 55/60 on the autoroutes too. The worry is the stickers. If you put them on you are actually flagging yourself up and saying "I must travel no faster than 90", making yourself a target for a gendarme with attitude. Just had a look through buy a car which lists the gross vehicle weight and the max towing weight to give the max train weight and even something like a Toyota Verso would need it, but some Zafiras come under the 3500 kg by 5kg, whereas others are over by a lot more. The Mazda 5, VW Touran are over and so are all the Citroen C4 Picasso range. All 4 door Mondeos are over. (Ford website) and most 5 door and estate Mondeos are too. All the new Galaxy range are 3500 or over. Should make for an interesting summer with the French police coffers swollen to bursting with on the spot fines.
I thought I understood this but now I'm really confused.
If you take the plated gross vehicle mass of my Zafira (2195kg) and add on the vehicles towing limit (1300kg) you'd get a total gross train mass (using the Caravan Club's example sheet) of 2195+1300=3495 - Yes!! A mere 5kg inside the 3500 limit.
But...
The plated permissable gross train weight is 3570 - ie 70kg OVER the 3500 limit.
How can this be the case and will I be legal at the higher speed or not? (that was a reciprocal question; I'll decide, thanks)
I thought i understood this before we went to France at Easter. We duly bought the stickers as we are over 3500 limit - but we never got around to putting the stickers on before we left - weather too wet and sleety! Then we forgot until we were at our desination. I've just read in Practical Caravan (June issue) that the speed limit for an outfit over 3.5 tonnes, the speed limit is 110kph (68mph). Where the CC article states that for outfits over 3.5t the speed limit is 90 (kph) which is why we bought the stickers in the first place. So who is right - CC or PC?
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Quote: Originally posted by Lassie on 25/5/2010
So who is right - CC or PC?
I wouldn't bet on it, but the CC have pretty good advisors and research very well. They are normally on the ball. Also their advice comes from their French opposite numbers.
However, my understanding is that towing a smart car on French roads (perhaps everywhere in mainland Europe?) with a campervan is illegal unless it is on a braked trailer and I am assured that law is not enforced - at least on UK registered vehicles, so - given the complexity of the legislation and the difficulty in ascertaining quickly at a roadside check, the total gross train of a combination, will the police attempt to enforce? I doubt it very much - especially with Saloon cars/MPV's when the actual weight will, in most cases, be well below 3.5 tonnes. (I know the actual weight is not what really counts)
Maybe we will hear during the summer, but if in doubt, drive slowly.
Please, I don't want to start a debate on the campervan towing car issue!
As it is written, (sounds like a sermon) it is the maximum plated train weight when towing, not the actual outfit weight. As before our outfit is around 3000 kg, but our maximum plated weight is 4250 kg. So we have the ridiculus scenario of a small car with a big caravan being OK and not needing to reduce speed limits or have some stickers, such as a Focus with a gross vehicle mass of 1950 kg towing a max 1500 kg caravan. But a Range Rover with a 500 kg trailer tent being limited and stickered to keep within the law.
And yes, I'm confused too, but I will get my kids to look out for outfits next week when we travel, and try to get some photos, either with or without stickers.
If the maximum recommended gross train weight is less than 3.5 Tonnes then you may drive at up to 130 KPH in dry conditions on the auto routes in France. If it is wet then you are restricted to 110 KPH. This is obviously rediculous as a light car with dubious braking can drive at speed where as a 4x4 with good braking cannot!!
Quote: Originally posted by Dandyman Bob on 25/5/2010
If the maximum recommended gross train weight is less than 3.5 Tonnes then you may drive at up to 130 KPH in dry conditions on the auto routes in France. If it is wet then you are restricted to 110 KPH. This is obviously rediculous as a light car with dubious braking can drive at speed where as a 4x4 with good braking cannot!!
Regards Bob
It seems madness to us, too; this new law seems to mean that underpowered vehicles can tow at higher speeds, whilst those with a greater towing capacity have to observe the slower speed limits, whether towing a caravan or even a camping trailer. How can that be logical?
So we have the ridiculus scenario of a small car with a big caravan being OK and not needing to reduce speed limits or have some stickers, such as a Focus with a gross vehicle mass of 1950 kg towing a max 1500 kg caravan. But a Range Rover with a 500 kg trailer tent being limited and stickered to keep within the law.
That's what it sounds like to us, too. Which isn't exactly going to make for safety on the French roads this summer, eh?
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Topic: France - towing speed limits
