So, in your opinion, does the Eldiss "watertight" construction match up to the Bailey monocoque construction?
I'll nail my colours to the flag: Bailey Alutech avoids structural problems whether water gets in or not. And without a pressure test on each 'van, Eldiss will never get every one water tight. And as timber is still used in the construction, delamination will still occur.
I aplaud bailey in getting rid of wood in the shell of the caravan, and with it they have a system that once they have ironed out all the imperfections be probably the best construction in UK vans. Eldis have made improvements in the sealing of the vans but IMO until they get rid of a wooden frame in the walls they will never get rid of the basic problem of rot..
------------- Bill
For a licence dated 1997 or later you must add together the plated max weight of the caravan and trailer, if the total is 3500 or less you can tow it. You may even tow a caravan with a MAM greater than the cars unladen mass the restriction was removed in 2013
Its always suprised me that caravan walls are not made from single extrusion plastic sheet as used in truck refrigerated body construction. Closed cell construction with intergrally extruded inner & outer walls so water ingress impossible. Perhaps some are but not by UK makers.
Hey tentz i'll take it you've never seen a refer body with delamination then
The best body you can get on a commercial trailer including fridges is ally sheets and rivets just like a caravan, the reason the industry has moved from that is mainly for cosmetic reasons i.e smooth sides that look better signwritten as apposed to looking like a tonka truck,
Well yes, obviously it makes for quicker & cheaper construction as the trailer sides are extruded in one piece. I used to use these reefer trailers all the time. They led quite a hard life being shipped unaccompanied between Holland/UK continuously, being pulled by all sorts of haulage companies & succeeded in lasting quite a few yrs. They were also easy to repair when damaged.
The fact they are closed cell construction would mean water would not soak in & any delamination would be a much cheaper repair than 'conventional' caravan construction. I think some caravans are constructed with this, Adria for example.
Adria have grp sidewalls, which i think is the same grp as in commercial vehicles i'e glass reinforced plywood. this construction is a nightmare over 45 ft as the sidewalls end up warping deaming the trailers scrap.
I think it works ok on the adrias as the sidewall is smaller, personally i wish all caravans were made of this as its solid, bailey are now making caravans the same way as the old fruehauf boxvans, ally and steel hopefully this should last years and hopefully the trend will spread to the other manufactures.
Whats all this Bailey talk about no wood? The whole floor is ply, it really amazes me the saleman speak that people accept and pass on as fact. Alu-tech is a clamping system not a no-wood system. SoLiD is a bonding system that removes the need for a secondary sealant.
Bailey are certainly not monocoque or wood free> The proof will out in time. Bailey have had loads of damp Alu-Techs but no more that any other manufaturers. In a couple of years we'll all know how Elddis have got on. To me, it seems a good step, if it was then linked to a composite frame rather than wood, that may be a further improvement.
As for Bailey avoiding structural problems, I havent really heard of too many of those from any manufacturer, poor internal finishing and damp seem to be by far the most issues in the last 3 years.
Just my thoughts
Simon
Quote: Originally posted by bessie500 on 06/9/2012
What fridges did you run Tentz G&A
I used to pull fridge trailers shipped from Holland off Harwich dock with loads of veg & bacon for UK supermkt RDCs. The trailers were mainly Dutch makes Vanhool, Pacton etc, very intensively used on a 24/7 basis so they only lasted a few yrs until they were scrapped. I did this on & off for 30 odd yrs, in that time they went from ally sided to the modern construction which reduced weight by about 2tonnes. Its fair to say the very lightweight ones didn't last that long but they wern't really intended to, the money was in the extra payload.
Quote: Originally posted by Simontodd on 06/9/2012
Whats all this Bailey talk about no wood? The whole floor is ply, it really amazes me the saleman speak that people accept and pass on as fact. Alu-tech is a clamping system not a no-wood system. SoLiD is a bonding system that removes the need for a secondary sealant.
Bailey are certainly not monocoque or wood free> The proof will out in time. Bailey have had loads of damp Alu-Techs but no more that any other manufaturers. In a couple of years we'll all know how Elddis have got on. To me, it seems a good step, if it was then linked to a composite frame rather than wood, that may be a further improvement.
As for Bailey avoiding structural problems, I havent really heard of too many of those from any manufacturer, poor internal finishing and damp seem to be by far the most issues in the last 3 years.
Just my thoughts
Simon
The fact remains that ALL caravans have a composite wooden floor and in general the floors do not have problems because of water damage, they are allowed to breath, are made from treated marine ply and are very rarely the cause of a caravan being condemned. Bailey now have walls that are completely resistant to water damage, they will not rot there is nothing in thm to rot. If the seams leak then any damage is cosmetic and not leading to total loss. The walls on a Bailey vn are now approaching the quality of the walls in my Hymer and if and when they sort out the problems thy have had with the construction they have every prospect of being better.
The Eldis approach is a step forward, and replace the wooden framework with a material that is not likely to suffer from rot and they may b onto a winner, but as long as the walls contain a wooden framework they will suffer from the inevitable problems of rot caused by water ingress just as every other imilarly constructed van does.
------------- Bill
For a licence dated 1997 or later you must add together the plated max weight of the caravan and trailer, if the total is 3500 or less you can tow it. You may even tow a caravan with a MAM greater than the cars unladen mass the restriction was removed in 2013
Having seen a couple of Elddis modeks with SOLID construction last weekend, they did appear well built BUT they are rather uninspiring inside ... we found them very dull inside compared to our Sterling with its sunroof and very pale woodwork.
------------- 2020 Volvo XC60 B5 R Design Geartronic / 2018 Swift Elegance 580
And a Hymer has no wood?, My Eriba (I sold last month) still had Ply floor.
In addition to my comments earlier, those of you that read caravan talk forums will be familiar with the countless threads currently discussing vans now having to be returned to factory for possible floor replacement. Water appears to be getting in front lockers and grab handles pooling underneath plastic inner skin. This is leading to the underfloor rotting.
Quote: Originally posted by Simontodd on 06/9/2012And a Hymer has no wood?, My Eriba (I sold last month) still had Ply floor.
In addition to my comments earlier, those of you that read caravan talk forums will be familiar with the countless threads currently discussing vans now having to be returned to factory for possible floor replacement. Water appears to be getting in front lockers and grab handles pooling underneath plastic inner skin. This is leading to the underfloor rotting.
Post last edited on 06/09/2012 19:28:15
Look at my post I stressed the ALL caravans have wooden floors, in addition Hymer vans have a wooden inner lining to the walls but unlike other vans it is marine ply, and is completely isolated from the oputside by totally impervious materials. The outer aluminium may get punctured but the polyurethans foam throws off any water, unlike the polystyrene usaed in most vans which just becomes water looged, if the water gets down by the screws it enters the aluminium frame and is held there by the aluminium. Do Hymer vans leak, I would be very surprised if they dd not but unlike other vans if they leak they do not rot and other things that Hymer do to prevent water ingress all help to make the structuire a much more sound one.
Water getting into the front locker and roting the floor is bad design, the floor in the gas locker of my Humer is not the same as the floor inside the van and there is a gap between that floor and the walls of the van, if it gets wet then the fibre glass ( I presume or similar material ) floor simply shrugs it off. Bailey need to look at it properly they need to refine their idea and iron out its imperfections.
------------- Bill
For a licence dated 1997 or later you must add together the plated max weight of the caravan and trailer, if the total is 3500 or less you can tow it. You may even tow a caravan with a MAM greater than the cars unladen mass the restriction was removed in 2013
Sorry don't trust Baileys to many vans over several years with front panel cracking and the design fault not being fixed, as for Elddis well my present van is an Eldiss 21 years old and as dry as a bone but then so was my previous Sprite musketeer 24 years old and my first Van a Monza also 24 years old when sold so may be I'm just lucky
Quote: Originally posted by IainM on 06/9/2012
Having seen a couple of Elddis modeks with SOLID construction last weekend, they did appear well built BUT they are rather uninspiring inside ... we found them very dull inside compared to our Sterling with its sunroof and very pale woodwork.
Agree completely Iain, we did the same thing last weekend. They're an attractive price certainly, and we even found the ideal layout for us. Unfortunately it just felt cheap inside, and I really wasn't enamoured with the quality of the trim and fixings.
As I said to the mrs, I'd rather spend the same amount on a used van that felt solid (no pun intended) than a new one that I thought half the bits inside might break off in my hand if I tried to use them.
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Topic: Eldiss Solid Construction
