In March this year, after 4 months of searching, we bought a Bessacarr 525SL 2003. The window price was £8995, we got a good deal and paid £7600 cash. We insured it for £9000. The van was immaculate and very little used. At the end of June this year whilst towing on the M5 we lost a wheel causing the van to be a write off. We have just heard from the 'in house' assessor that he has valued our van at just £6000. He advised us that Bessacarrs are over priced and we should instead buy a Bailey 7 series or Swift! We spent months looking for our perfect first caravan and have spent a small fortune on items to match. The glass guide for our model is £6975 so how can he possibly value it at less? We don't expect the insurers to pay out £9000 but we do expect them to pay out the replacement cost. Is there a regulatory body that could help us?
I have not claimed for caravan insurance, but would imagine it is very much like claiming for a car, do not accept the first or even second offer. They always give a lower valuation. Go back to them with the Glass guide which is for the van only, if any of the contents were damaged/written off, then you should be offered a seperate amount for them assuming you had them insured. (My insurance shows van and contents as 2 seperate amounts)
The loss adjuster has opened negotiations and given you his opinion - reject his kind offer and push for the cost of the replacement. See if you can find a dealer/s with your model & year of caravan on sale and pass this information on to him as evidence of the cost to replace your van like for like.
I have not had experience of this problem, but the way I understand it is that you firstly negotiate your case with the assessor and, if you do not come to an agreement, as Shirley said, tell him you do not accept hid findings giving the reasons for this (i.e. the Glass guide). I have to say that I have not seen a Glass guide, but if it has a buyers price and a sellers price, you should argue that you are a buyer and that it is the higher price that you need as you would be buying.
When I have dealt with insurance companies before all the assessors have been independant from the insurance company (although they are employed by the insurance company). If, after discussion, you don't get any joy with the assessor, then get back to the insurance company and open dialogue with them directly giving them the opportunity to find a solution. If they fail to do this, or find with the assessor, then the next stage would be to make an official complaint to them (in writing).
Once you have made an official complaint, if you do not get a satisfactory result, then the next stage would be to take your case to the Financial Ombudsman, who would then mediate between you and the company. (Insurance companies have been regulated by the Financial Services Authority since 2005 and so disputes are dealt with in this way.) The Ombudsman's service is free, but you can only go to him after you have officially complained to the Insurance Company, and have told them this is what you are going to do, and after you have has no luck with the insurance companies complaints proceedure. The Financial Ombudsman will attempt to mediate between you and the insurance company and can also formally investigate your claim and make a binding order against the insurance company.
If you fail to convince the Financial Ombudsman of your case, then you still have the right to take the company to court.
The problem, of course is that the whole process takes time and is probably a stressful experience, but should not cost you any money unless you decide it is worth taking the company to court, other than for postage and phone call costs. Before taking court action, I would certainly take professional advice.
This is just my understanding of the process, and I would certainly check all of this out elsewhere as I am no expert. I would fully exhaust each stage before moving up to the next.
I have to say, that the only time I have dealt with a serious caravan claim was when we had our previous van stolen. We were insured with the caravan club and they were very good indeed in sorting out our claim fairly and amicably - I had no dispute with them at all. The person on here who is likely to be able to advise on legal matters is Phil. Perhaps he will be along later and can either confirm, amend or throw out my suggestions.
Hope this might have helped a little, until someone else comes along.
If you are a member of the caravan club you can phone their insurance dpt who will be able to tell you the book value of your caravan, subject to this being higher than the offer it can be used as evidence to support your claim.
In years gone by the industry used to deduct 10% from the book valuation, their reasoning being that buying without a part exchange should result in a reduction of this order, I do not think it applies now.
As mentioned above you need to evidence to support why your van is worth more than their offer.
Caravan value also includes equipment as opposed to personal effects.
Let me tell you a little story about insurance and how they tried to escape their duty of payout. I bought a 1.8i petrol Vauxhall Cavalier back in 1997 that was 3 years old from the company I worked for, and because it was the reps car that had covered over 125000 miles, they decided I could buy it for £3000. I insured the car with Preferred Direct and 6 months later we were involved in a head on collision. The third party was to blame but that is a separate issue so I will stay focused on the insurance payout. An assessor inspected the vehicle a few days later and declared the vehicle a write off. A few days later I recieved a letter from Preferred Direct insurance stating that they were going to pay me out a sum of £2,500 for the car. I phoned their claims department and queried this figure. Their statement was that as I paid £3,000 for the car they had valued it at £2,500 which was their final offer. I explained that I paid £3,000 because of the high mileage which reflected the purchase price but when I fill the application form I don't have to declare this. The registration identifies the year of the car and that's it. According to the valuation figure from the 'Parkers' price guide it was actually worth in the region of £5,800. I was asking for £5,300 and I wasn't going to budge either. Because I was the innocent party and my purchase had nothing to do with the value, I wasn't prepared to suffer this loss at any cost. They disagreed and said this was their final figure. I stated that I wasn't prepared to accept their figure and take the matter further and prepared to take them to court. I explained that the insurance company had already lost their case immediately because when I put the case to the judge, my comments will be, "So what this insurance company is saying exactly, is that if I win a brand new car in a competition and have paid nothing for it, they are prepared to take money from to insure it but not prepared to pay in a claim because I paid nothing for it". Sorry mate you've lost your case already. I upped my figure then to £5,500 as I was now playing the ace card. The insurance company submitted because a few days later I received a cheque for the sum of £5,500 as requested.
So going back to your case now, look at the facts. The insurance company issues a policy and charges the rate of the caravan value disregards how much you paid for it. As each year goes by, the value of your caravan decreases and so should you policy in reflection of this. All insurance companies are there to make profit and it doesn't matter who's feet they tread on they just want your money. But when it comes to paying out quite the reverse happens and they try to find the slightest clause to make the claim void or reduce the sum of payout. It's what they call tactics but don't fall for it. What you need to do is find out the exact value of your caravan via the Glass's guide. If you can't find out then play the trick question. Go to a dealer pretending that you are interested in purchasing a new van. When the salesman asks, "Do you have a part exchange?" Answer yes and give them the year and model of your van. They will look in their Glass's guide and BINGO! you now have the official valuation figure of your caravan. Now, whatever happens with your insurance company, don't submit to their call because you now have the bullets to fire in support of your case. You have already lost your caravan, don't submit to losing your rights as well.
The glass guide is just what it says,its a guide.Being in the motor trade insurance companies keep note of what things are selling at, not what anybody prices them .If you pick up a car/van at what you think is a bargain price, because you have seen it on the fore court for more and,insure it for that price,it does not mean that on the open market that its worth that.It could be made of gold but like i said on the open market the price you pay is not what its worth.
see price guide,does not help really on price.do not understand the logic of paying for an insurance policy for £9000 and then when it goes wrong they only offer £6000.ours is insured for £6000 will they only offer £3500.in other words you are not getting what you paid for.if it was me i would say can you please pay what i asked for £9000 due to the short time of ownership and no time for depreciation on the caravan.
At the end of the day take note of how much your car/van has devalued on the open market,not price guides,and insure it for only that.you may be paying a high premium with a price guide.
At the end of the day take note of how much your car/van has devalued on the open market,not price guides,and insure it for only that.you may be paying a high premium with a price guide.
Michael, unfortunately it would be open to fraudsters who would overvalue their car/caravan with the deliberate intention of having a total loss claim and making extra money from it. (A scam to you and me).
Specialist insurers use "Agreed Value" for vintage cars and the like.
What michael says is exactly the point I was trying to get over. If the caravan was insured for £9,000 then the insurance quotation would have be for the sum insured obviously. If the insurance company felt that the caravan wasn't worth £9,000 to begin with why didn't they say because caravan insurance companies ALL have access to the Glass's guide so there's no excuse. They didn't because like I said in my previous post that will take your money whichever way they can but it's when a claim is submitted that the insurance offers well below the sum you insured the goods for. Basically it's just another cover up for mis-selling and it's being proved times out of number especially with utility companies and in my view insurance is no different as they are full of broken promises and fail to delivering what you have paid for with your hard earned cash.
Hi, an insurance company has to ensure you are returned to your pre-incident position. So the loss adjusters suggestion that you buy another make is outrageous. If they think your make is overvalued they should refuse to insure them. I suspect they are trying their luck. Most companies do not use the value you submit as a rating factor when calculating premiums and settle on book price. Check your documents and you should find them confirming same.
Return to them in writing with the glass' guide figure and also get some adverts for similar vehicles within say a 20 mile radius of your house. It would be worth noting in your letter that if you are not satisfied you will log a formal complaint after which you will escalate to the Financial ombudsman. If the ombudsman takes on a complaint they automatically charge the insurers about £300. This combined with the costs of handling your complaint could encourage them to settle at the guide price as it wont be too farfrom the difference between their offerand the guide price.
Just a few matters to raise in addition to Davids excellent description of the process.
1. Check just what your insurance policy says about the sums they pay for a write off.
2. Quoting prices on forecourts is one thing...what they actually sell for can be different. Might be better to use prices of actual sales.
3. Forecourt prices will include the dealers mark up and in undertaking a valuation of your van the loss adjuster may not include for that in its market price.
4. Is the assessor a caravan "expert"? Some insurers pass the work to loss adjusters who normally deal with the motor trade.
5. Don't get hung up on the valuation you submitted to your insurers and for which you have paid a premium for that level of cover. The insurers give no warranty that your figure is correct. It is your figure, not theirs. Its your choice to pay a premium for £9000 of cover. Focus on this aspect too much and you just end up missing the real point of your argument.
6. You insurance policy should include the complaints procedure
7 Arguing that they are trying to save money is the equivalent of saying that they are acting in bad faith and that impugns their reputation. Best not to insult them
8. Insurance Companies have to abide by the “Treating Customers Fairly Rule” which is enforced by the Financial Services Authority. You may wish to argue that, in your view a settlement along the lines you have suggested (supported by evidence) would meet that standard. It can be useful to quote this Rule.
Phil
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CCLUB who we are with will not let you over estimate as they work from there book and rules.when i said mine was worth £5500 or there abouts they said no its £6000.BUT this could include a mover replacement.so extras are worth thinking about.
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Topic: Problem with insurers paying out
